Shoegazing Podcast Episode 14

Shoegazing Podcast episode with Daniel Wegan

Notes

• Shoegazing Podcast Episode 3 for Daniel’s backstory

More Casual Fashion Trend

• has been a topic for many years
• harder to find occasion for formal shoes
• more global market, climates not to suitable, more loafers and slippers
• doesn’t make a huge number of really formal shoes
• more vibrant colors, more broguing
• bend the rules with color and texture first
• beautiful finishes are desirable even if you don’t know when you’ll wear it
• venture out into heavier boots, lighter summer shoes
• no or very few dress codes ban dress shoes
• Catella doesn’t see a lot of heavy boots, but they have some orders
• would have to make samples to make people aware
• workwear styles can be a bit easier to fit: larger, not so sleek
• “something for my ranch”
• has customers in Texas

American Workwear

• massive trend
• not so much overseas, still a niche there
• people Daniel’s age often start with workwear
• often start from denim
• into Red Wings
• once they have all commonly available brands, want something else
• bespoke fit, better leathers
• know what you want, realize it’s not out there
• expects brands to offer made-to-order, customization
• Indonesian makers
• compare dress shoes: most styles from 20s-40s, with tweaks
• “once you put a sneaker sole on it, it’s over”

Will Catella maker sneakers?

• “everything has a price”
• very complicated to make well one-off
• made to be mass-produced
• best made with machines
• cup soles have to do molds, very expensive one-off
• lose what’s cool about them conforming to what shoemaker can do
• watching 3D printing
• maybe small runs of sole units
• uppers made like any shoe
• can make early EVA soles, like early runners
• even though simpler, need practice

Work-Related Injuries

• tendons, carpal tunnel surgery
• quite fortunate: no real issues
• in beginning, had strained tendons
• was tensing hands with unfamiliar tools
• holding really big, heavy shoes in one hand
• went to specialist to massage the hand
• when starting out, was still going to the gym
• varied work situation helps: lasts, pattern cutting, not just making
• especially bottom making difficult
  • small chairs
  • un-ergonomic position
  • lots of hours in
• get out of the chair at least once an hour
• find different positions
• don’t have to do everything in your lap
• experiment with stands
• changing position important
• keep posture in mind, especially at end of day
• go to the gym
• core strength for back
• Daniel still runs
• running probably not the best for shoemaking
• working with blunt tools requires too much force
• “work smarter, not harder”
• “sharpen your knife!”
  • probably the most common issue
  • especially for new people
  • sharpening well is difficult
  • “can’t really do the work”
  • learn sharpening before shoemaking
  • even with experience, get different results with proper sharpness
  • need more comfort zone to do beautiful work
  • “hold the knife wrong and it’s blunt”
  • “think twice, cut once”
  • “long, single cuts rather than chopping away at it”
  • “use your head a bit more”
• self-conscious about what he looks like when working
• music nerds also seem to focus on making their play look more elegant or easier
  • similar problems with repetitive stress
  • lighter touch
• lots of time ahead of him, can’t imagine doing anything else

Go-To Pair of Shoes

• doesn’t wear a lot of dress shoes in life
• obsessed with shoemaking, not shoe wearing
• if wearing shoes he made, ends up spending time thinking about how they fit, how they crease, etc.
• doesn’t see a lot of people day to day, especially during COVID
• low need for formality
• more of an occasion to wear his own shoes
• self-conscious that people are judging his shoes
• hard to find time to make yourself perfect shoes
• if you’re successful, you’re always behind on orders
• customer shoes are the priority
• made a lot of shoes for himself as an apprentice, not impressed with them
  • give many away
  • threw some away
• wears lots of New Balance shoes in the workshop
• bad ankle from old cycling injury likes cushion
• obvious that he didn’t make them, so nobody judging them
• has quite slim feet, not easiest to make a pretty pair for
• hates the way his shoes come out
• “doesn’t look like a pencil”
• long and thin, on the flat side
• prefers wider feet with little bunion or high instep
• working on some shoes for him now

Most Extreme Shoe He’s Made

32:16

• common question
• “it’s very rare that you make very weird or crazy shoes”
• other companies known for crazy shoes, e.g. Berluti, Christophe Corthay
• unique work is very difficult to do, e.g. proportions
• most attempts “look like shit”
• e.g. Corthay early on
• made room for companies like G&G
• creates a middle ground between extreme Berluti and staid, orthodox classics
• “somebody has to be, like, the rebel, so the rest of us can find our own voice and our own market”

What would you never do?

• avoids things he doesn’t think he would do well
• most clients come to him familiar with his work
• for other new makers, it’s common for customers to come in with photos of shoes from other, pricier brands that they want done cheaper
  • “get what you pay for”
  • can be difficult to copy a style
  • might be completely different foot shape
  • “I can make my interpretation of this, but I can’t make it look like that picture”
  • hard to remove your personality from shoes you make
  • will look like he made it
• identity can get in the way replicating a different tradition
• e.g. would be very hard for him to make Austrian or Hungarian style shoe

How do you prepare the bottoms of lasts?

38:49

• supports the weight
• depends on customer and their goals
  • e.g. orthotics
  • can be hard to replicate orthotics with traditional methods
  • no fine-tuning of flex with leather
  • different compromise on, e.g., longevity
• contoured from heel to ball
• feather edge
  • a guide for the insole shape
  • “need this line to know the balance of the shoe”
  • without, would teeter side to side like an edge
  • developed from manufacturing
  • early lasts very foot-shaped
  • shoemaker would make own feather edge with insole
  • for crisp sole finishing, need a guide, especially around the heel seat
  • still dome the heel
  • really hard to make premade heel stacks fit domed heel shapes
  • very time-consuming to use bespoke methods
  • to make thousands, making has to be easy
  • lasts shapes “kind to the workers and the equipment”
  • some need support more than others
• arch support
  • for knee alignment
  • would never call “orthopedic”
  • “ortho-bespoke” — nicer looking orthopedic shoes
  • when bought by government as medical aid, have to hit low price point
  • “highlight their ailment rather than disguise it”
  • common to hear clients with ergonomic concerns
• some people without issues may not be comfortable with really close, ergonomic fit
• e.g. pelotte to support metatarsal arch too high, preventing natural flex, uncomfortable
• “if it’s not broke…”
• definitely more built-up arch than other makers
  • likes the way it looks, shape-wise
  • can feel the shoe touching all over the foot
  • makes it unique

Cost Breakdown

• can’t do it
• tries to find price point where every customer serviced where appropriate to them
• really hard to predict complexity of projects
• easy fits v hard fits
• easy to fit feet but more complicated style, simple shoe style but complicated fit
• single price point for all clients
• like insurance: can afford to fix problems
• nobody really underwhelmed so far
• materials and time
• definitely pay more for the time
• most expensive leathers in the world, but affordable compared to the time
• trips to see people for fitting
• want frequent trunk shows to make fitting times shorter
• always do multiple pattern tests, left and right if feet different
• need a level of financial comfort to create great work
• “happy in your life”
• apprentices can live off passion, but nobody wants to feel punished for choosing shoemaking
• “very few really good rich shoemakers”
• “if you want to earn a quick buck, run while you can”

Time Breakdown

• if you have a fitting last
• lastmaking, pattern cutting, making fitting shoe — 2 or 3 days
• more complicated fits: all that three or four times, close to 2 weeks
• becomes unprofitable exercise to make sure the client is happy
• if have a fitting last, making probably 80 hours on average
• never have a project go all to plan
• e.g. vein pops up when pulling upper over the last
• “put it in a box and make another one”
• leather an unforgiving material
• “if you do it long enough, it [mistake] will happen”
• everyone starting shoemaking, so much time spent little things that aren’t shoemaking, in preparation
  • skiving
  • beautiful finishing takes years, even if you know all the tricks
• basically, shoe takes 80–100 hours, including all the little jobs
• e.g. packing up safely so not destroyed in shipping
• bespoke firms at lower price points, can see the shoes have to move between hands faster
• “it’s hard to work quick and perfect”
• “take a deep breath and chill a little bit”
• “very few real rip-offs coming out of independent shoemakers”, small workshops with a couple people
• does client get the emotional reward?
• forums: people want to be told what is the best shoe, but no such thing
• “even an average shoemaker is a very hard worker”
• “I know a lot of people who work a lot less for a lot more”
• can’t coast
• not all purchases rational
• wouldn’t know how to make shoes twice as fast for half the price
• different job